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General Discussion: The other most expressive controller and user mode

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written by: barnone

I've been off the internets for many days, which was actually fantastic.

Yes, I agree that most people just want to play an instrument and a fine instrument it is. The feedback is just to plant ideas because I think that the combination of the standard EigenD modes with a user mode that is based on the blank canvas approach that the monome pioneered would be exceptionally powerful.

As far as midi matrix providing the outgoing communication, it's a great feature but does not satisfy the needs of a user mode, where the outgoing communication is not reduced (interpreted as) notes but is instead the coordinates of the keys in the canvas window that are being pressed + the continuous data can be separate messages.

Happy holidays to all at Eigenlabs. I'm sure it's been a huge and exceptionally busy year for you all.

written by: barnone

Wed, 22 Dec 2010 20:39:03 +0000 GMT

There is been a lot of discussion that eigend must exist because the data rate and latency issues are too much for any other host, etc etc. It must therefore be it's own host and closed.

I just wanted to point out a controller that has a high data rate yet manages to be an open platform for development using the simple model of the monome where there is a protocol for incoming data generated from interaction, and a separate decoupled protocol for lighting the pads.

That is the manta

7 Mantas

As you can see in the video, we are sequencing with a groove template which I cannot do for example with the arranger yet. In general, I don't expect or want Eigenlabs to write every possible software mode that could be conceived on this device.

I can throw a manta object into MAX/MSP and get continuous high resolution data streams off multiple keys on a 3ms or even less refresh rate.

Because the controller uses this simple protocol, I can extend it and the community of users can start building apps to share with each other for the device.

I would really like to see EigenD have such an extension mode. One idea would be to have a "user mode", this would be like choosing "user 1" instead of "sampler 1" for example, when in this mode, an external application could communicate with the allocated canvas area of the user mode with a free interpretation and receive key press data as key coordinates and continuous controller data.

This is not a new concept. The Novation Launchpad has similar and it allowed to device to emulate the monome which was a big part of it's success.

If eigenD is indeed such a flexible architecture, such a mode should be possible. The trick it to make the communication with this mode as simple as possible.


written by: geert

Thu, 23 Dec 2010 07:53:12 +0000 GMT

@barnone, thanks for the suggestions.

We're gradually heading into that direction, step by step. The new routing matrix is the outgoing part of the picture for MIDI land, there will be new developments to allow the lights to be addressed in a flexible manner, and OSC is underway as you already noticed. However, you have to realize that the data rates we're talking about actually are so elevated that they easily take down a UDP stack. We're working on it, but getting data out of EigenD will at the moment always reduce the resolution (even OSC over a gigabit network), so EigenD is really needed to get the most out of the Eigenharp if you use it more as an instrument and less as a controller. Also, many of our customers actually love the intuitiveness of just launching EigenD and starting to play, without having to learn anything else. They're not interested in Belcanto, MIDI, OSC, ... they just want to play an instrument. We continuously work on improving the Eigenharp to move forward for all the different kinds of users. Getting this kind of feedback is very valuable though, as it gives us real expectations that we can keep in mind while designing and implementing what's coming next.

Thanks!

Geert


written by: LAYER8

Sat, 25 Dec 2010 14:09:20 +0000 GMT

The easiest solution for Eigenlabs should be to document the protocol which is used on the USB connection. With this the complete eigenD SW stack could be replaced. Whther this is possible of course depends on the intellectual properties involved and the work required.
I guess this would be part of open sourcing part of eigenD.

Doing this would also open up the eigenharp to the Linux world - although I understand this is not the most important platform.


written by: dhjdhj

Sat, 25 Dec 2010 22:06:29 +0000 GMT

I would love to see this as an option. Assuming eigenlabs will make most of their money from their hardware, having third party software tools available would only help to sell even more devices.


written by: barnone

Wed, 29 Dec 2010 03:28:57 +0000 GMT

I've been off the internets for many days, which was actually fantastic.

Yes, I agree that most people just want to play an instrument and a fine instrument it is. The feedback is just to plant ideas because I think that the combination of the standard EigenD modes with a user mode that is based on the blank canvas approach that the monome pioneered would be exceptionally powerful.

As far as midi matrix providing the outgoing communication, it's a great feature but does not satisfy the needs of a user mode, where the outgoing communication is not reduced (interpreted as) notes but is instead the coordinates of the keys in the canvas window that are being pressed + the continuous data can be separate messages.

Happy holidays to all at Eigenlabs. I'm sure it's been a huge and exceptionally busy year for you all.



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